Moyes on the way out?

[Bob Singleton]

David Johnson wrote:

"There those on here that argued that he got dealt a bum deal from Ferguson in being left a team in need of a comprehensive rebuild. Those claims have been proved worthless given that the team are on course for their lowest points total ever in the Premier League and will miss out on the Champions League for the first time since '95. How many times has the United team been rebuilt since then whilst maintaining success?"


I'm one of those, who in another thread, claimed the United squad weren't fit for purpose. If the squad is so strong, David, why have media commentators and pundits been talking about having to spend ?100m, ?150m or even ?200m in the summer? Why have United supporters themselves suggested there was a need for wholesale changes as early as last summer? Was it because the squad was superb, or because the squad was shite? Ask any Liverpool supporter which Man Utd players they'd like in their squad? Same of Man City and Chelsea supporters? The list of coveted payers will not be long.

While Moyes was never going to be another Ferguson, he was left with a poor squad of players.

The Glazers have much to answer for... Maurice Watkins (one of the top lawyers in the north of England) was allowed to leave and replaced by a nobody. The Chief Executive, David Gill, was also allowed to leave at the same time as Ferguson. Sorry, but the Glazers should have said, one of you can retire this season, but the other will have to wait a while. No business can properly survive when so many at the pointy end of the management structure leave at the same time. You had a situation where both the football manager and the club's chief executive left at the same time! Stupid beyond belief. And why did all of this come about? Because the Glazers want to cut costs.

Moyes was championed as a manager who could do great things on small resources (ideal for a club leveraged to the hilt). That's why he got given the job.

Does anyone really think that if Klopp or van Gaal come in, they'll be given ?150m to spend? They never gave Ferguson that sort of money in the last few years when he most needed it.

Playing a 40 year old Giggs and bringing Scholes out of retirement where his answer to the midfield problems. "There's no value in the market" we kept hearing Ferguson say... yet Man City got Toure for a decent price, Chelsea got Mata for a decent price, Liverpool got Coutinho for a bargain price! The real reason was because "the Glazers won't give me any money"

You also have to question Ferguson regarding why players like Paul Pogba were allowed to leave when the midfield was so sparse... he even admitted two years earlier that it would be stupid NOT to play him and allow him to leave on a free.

Is Moyes a tactical genius? Absolutely not. But the blame for United's poor season shouldn't be left at his feet alone.

[MrTickle]

Should they also sack the person responsible for recommending him in the first place?

[max_tranmere]

Manchester United sacked David Moyes an hour ago. I just hope he doesn't get a huge pay-off, it is hardly fair that someone gets a pile of cash for doing a sub-standard job. I wonder if the next one will be a Scot like the last two have been.

[Bob Singleton]

max_tranmere wrote:

> Manchester United sacked David Moyes an hour ago. I just hope
> he doesn't get a huge pay-off, it is hardly fair that someone
> gets a pile of cash for doing a sub-standard job. I wonder if
> the next one will be a Scot like the last two have been.


The fact they sacked him now (when it was no longer mathematically possible to qualify for the Champions League) suggests that the clause in his contract some papers are talking about may be correct. Seems he will only get a 1 year pay-off.

[Milk Tray Man]

never mind the Champions League. The way things are going they'll struggle to quality for the Europa League.

[cockneygeezer2009]

"Moyes collects his P45"

And a lorry load of cash.

What makes me laugh is that some people say Moyes should have kept the backroom staff. What!! Nothing to do a Ferguson as a manager then.
I personally thought Man U would have kept Moyes for another year but then again i'm not a Man U fan. Will be interesting to see who'll be the next manager.

[Bob Singleton]

Milk Tray Man wrote:

> never mind the Champions League. The way things are going
> they'll struggle to quality for the Europa League.
>


I was alluding to the reports in some papers that there was a clause in Moyes' contract that if Man Utd didn't qualify for the Champions League, his contract could be terminated with just a one year pay-off. That happened when they lost to Everton.

[JamesW]

David Johnson wrote:

> On
> top of that I don't think there is any precedent for a side
> that finished top in the Premier League falling to 7th in a
> season.


Yes there is a precedent. Blackburn Rovers.

[Bob Singleton]

JamesW wrote:


>
> Yes there is a precedent. Blackburn Rovers.
>

There are also precedents in other sports, too. We need look no further than Old Trafford itself. In 2011 Lancashire County Cricket Club won the County Championship. The following season saw them relegated to the 2nd Division.

I'm not sure that David Johnson has much idea about football. He certainly only seems to see things in black and white... 'my opinion is that David Moyes is entirely to blame, and I am always right" seems to be the underlying current of his thoughts regarding United's demise.

[David Johnson]

I agree with much of your post. The Glazers made a big mistake allowing Ferguson and Gill to go in the same season. Moyes compounded that error by getting rid of the back room staff under Ferguson. This left Moyes with a job that was going to be tougher than it needed to be.

Having said that what cannot be denied is that with exactly the same group of players that romped home last season, Moyes has led Utd to relative mediocrity with a whole series of "firsts" of the wrong kind e.g. out of the Champions League first time in blah, blah years etc. etc. and a large number of games where their performances have been absolutely pathetic.

In terms of spending, I don't think the comments you make about the money available from the Glazers stacks up. Despite having lost considerable expertise in the transfer market as a result of GIll going, Man Utd still managed to spend almost ?70 million on Fellaini and Mata alone this season. Apparently additional offers for a range of players including Baines were turned down.

The Glazers are business people pure and simple and they understand that for the long term building of the brand they need success. They can go without success for a year or two, simply by doing tours to far flung places etc in the close season, but long term they realise that there has to be a flow of new players to help bring success. They realised that this was beyond Moyes and got shot sharpish.