Immigration Street...

[max_tranmere]

It is correct that illegal immigrants can't get Benefits but anyone can get emergency NHS treatment. No checks are made when you show up at A&E, you just give your details, and are treated. I'm not talking just about people who come in an ambulance and must get treatment there and then, but also people who just arrive at A&E, then sit and wait. Legal citizens from time to time do this as a way of avoiding the waiting time for their GP - and if and when illegals show up and do it they'd get help too.

[Bob Singleton]

max_tranmere wrote:

> It is correct that illegal immigrants can't get Benefits but
> anyone can get emergency NHS treatment. No checks are made when
> you show up at A&E, you just give your details, and are
> treated. I'm not talking just about people who come in an
> ambulance and must get treatment there and then, but also
> people who just arrive at A&E, then sit and wait. Legal
> citizens from time to time do this as a way of avoiding the
> waiting time for their GP - and if and when illegals show up
> and do it they'd get help too.


At my local A&E (Kingston upon Thames) they ask you all sorts of questions... full name, date of birth, place of birth, how long you've lived in the country, name of doctor etc. as well as asking for some form of ID (a driving licence is preferred as it has a photo, but at the very least a debit/credit card is expected, or your plastic NI card). Those who can't provide such ID are quizzed further (in the case of those too young to have such ID, given their age they are normally accompanied by a parent who is asked for ID). Maybe other hospitals are lax, or maybe Kingston are more stringent than others in making these checks, but I seriously doubt any illegal immigrant would get treated there. I've also seen non-urgent cases being turned away and told not to waste their (ie the A&E's) time and to go to a local walk-in centre or get a doctor's appointment.

If in your area you can just walk in to your local A&E and circumvent waiting to see a GP then something is very wrong.

[Peter]

As its all over the news today that there's to be a trial to make people *prove* they're entitled to use GP/NHS services, it would seem that you currently only have to claim you have the right to obtain treatment.

None of this will matter though, the hospitals still won't turn away anyone needing (or wanting) treatment, and the 'Lagos Shuttle' regulars will still be squeezing out kids courtesy of the UK taxpayer.

[David Johnson]

" the 'Lagos Shuttle' regulars will still be squeezing out kids courtesy of the UK taxpayer."

I am struggling to understand the logic here. A woman sat in Nigeria decides she wants to give birth on the NHS so:

1. She applies for a visa which presumably could take a few months to come through.

2. "Shuttle" implies a return trip so she buys a return ticket for say ?400.

3. Happily, the birth of the child coincides with the visa and the air flight dates.

4. She sits at home in Lagos with her new borne child and thinks "That was a big saving!".

Two questions:

1. I assume that they have doctors and midwives in Nigeria?
2. ?400 would buy you a lot of private health care in Nigeria, wouldn't it?

So where is the logic here?

[David Johnson]

A Nigerian wants to take advantage of the Lagos shuttle so she can get free healthcare from the NHS.

She arrives in London having forked out ?400 on a return ticket and paid for a visa etc.

She throws herself under a London bus and ends up being treated by the NHS.

She goes back to Nigeria well pleased that she has saved a packet.

[max_tranmere]

I would be very surprised if people have to prove anything. I've been to A&E (where I've been in pain and needed help quite soon, but not an ambulance job) and they just take down the details you verbally give them without you having to back them up with documentation, then you wait, then you get seen.

The 'Lagos shuttle' would more appropriately be called the 'world shuttle'. St Mary's Hospital in Paddington has a queue literally a hundred metres long for the sexual health test clinic. Someone I used to know who worked in the hospital for years told me most come from abroad, a lot on day trips from Europe.

A lot of visitors get free treatment from the NHS for all kinds of things, so do many who have recently settled here. Just look at how many mothers from abroad give birth in Britain:

[max_tranmere]

You raised the issue of how there are hospitals and midwives in Nigeria. There obviously are but they are nothing like to the standard we have here. I've been to Nigeria and I remember hearing that families camp outside the hospitals and take in food for their relative to eat as there is none given in the hospital. I'm not sure how it's paid for, I would imagine you pay yourself and if you can't you're screwed. Here, it is obviously all free.

[David Johnson]

Your reply to my post has nothing to do with that post.

I repeat - where is the logic in a Nigerian woman coming over here on the "Lagos shuttle" to have a baby.

[David Johnson]

Again Max you completely miss the point.

If a woman is coming over from Lagos specifically to have a baby on the NHS, she would need to buy a plane ticket, visa, accommodation and food for an unknown time because no-one can predict to the day when the baby will arrive. You would also presumably want to bring someone with you at all the extra costs involved etc etc.


A huge outlay which one would have thought would have bought the best healthcare available in Nigeria. I find it hard to believe that all government wives invariably go abroad for weeks on the offchance they will give birth during a specific period.

[max_tranmere]

It was Peter who coined it the 'Lagos shuttle', I just said it would be more appropriate to call it the 'World shuttle'. Peter needs to explain to you about the 'Lagos shuttle' thing, not me.