Mandatory condom use & permits to film?

[one eyed jack]

I could never take the results of an anonymous poll seriously on a forum because I know that many might say they are in favour o it but post the opposite in a vote

This is precisely what happened with our campaign. Everyone did a mexican cheer in support but come the day we had the docs from the three main clinics, a lawyer and several sponsors willing to sign cheques there and then (including myself) everyone else who mattered decided they had work to do and couldnt attend.

My conscience is clean as far as I'm concerned. I shoot couples. It just depends if any producer is willing to take the risk and go condom only but deep down, no one wants to take that risk because it is the road to financial ruin

There are some genres that can get away with it but the fantasy aspect of what a lot fo producers are trying to achieve will be lost if this became law.

Kim, I refuse to beleive that the governors in LA give a shit about the people in the San Fernando valley. it is a tool designed to force the industry out. You just have to read some femi nazi propoganda like Gail Dines book Pornoland to reinforce that idea. Shes scary because shes smart and makes a few good points which is why I bought the book but the heart of the matter is she is driven by a hatred of the porn industry and the new war against it will be fought on political grounds to control it.

You just have to read the book or take my word for it but the stuff Im reading about and listening to in podcasts tell me there are people, including religious rightwingers who are trying to find new ways of sabotaging the industry and are making a damn good living out of it it seems.

Shelly Lubben who is an ex performer of some 100+ scenes always goes on YouTube and The Pink Cross Foundation decrying the porn industry and breaks down in an emotional niagra of tears. I'm convinced she has traded one hustle for another with this born again christian stuff. She is making money by attacking the business. I'm not excluding the fact her experiences may be genuine. I'm just saying if there was no money in doing what she was doing she wouldnt be doing it at all. Shes a self confessed bad seed from the beginning which is why she got into porn and was probably treated like trash simply because she allowed herself to be for the money. Who ever she is talking about is certainly not the likes of me and Ive met her type and told em to sling their hooks.

I just dont buy the whole concern for the health of porn stars doing bareback. The ratio of HIV in the industry versus the rest of the state doesnt even warrant a comparison.

The real reason is MONEY. None of those campaigning and lobbying for it are doing it for free and thats the thing that makes me puke about these so called do-gooders.

Porn really isnt that important for people to be expending energies on. We have proved already that we are mature enough to deal with our own affairs without people on the outside meddling in what they have no real idea is about.

[jimslip]

I was just thinking about things and I thought, "Why the fuck should we be so sensible?" We are in the entertainment industry, we are SUPPOSED to be reckless and dangerous, that is our job, we sell fantasy!

In a Hollywood blockbuster just before a passionate love scene, do the actors turn to camera and say, "Oh by the way, naturally we'll be using condoms, because it would be very unwise to have an illicit, rampant sex session without visiting the chemist first!" and then continue the scene?

Or would the Prodigy video of "Firestarter" have a caption running across at the bottom, saying, "It would be very unwise to be a firestarter in real life because you could cause damage to people and property!"

Do computer game designers have flashing warnings saying "Emptying a magazine from an M16 automatic rifle into someone could result in harm, please don't do this at home!"

The entertainment industry doesn't do "Sensible". It is up to Health Care providers and education to do the "sensible" bit, our job is to entertain. That's why no one wants condom porn, because it says, "Sensible" and the consumer wants the fantasy of, "Reckless abandonment". Condom porn is like choosing music from the, "Easy listening" section at HMV!

Remember the Rock industry's mantra, "Sex, drugs and rock'n'roll?"

How dare they?? That is just so irresponsible, if you have unprotected sex and some drugs and listen to loud rock and roll, you could not only damage your ears, but you could also contract a serious infection! !wink!

Enough with all this, "Common sense" already and lets get on with entertaining the fans!

[andy at handiwork]

Spot on Jim.

[videokim]

I only say an anonymous poll because girls/guys feel they would be blacklisted by certain producers if they spoke out, i have had 6 emails today from girls saying they would prefer condoms but do it anyway without because they need the work.

If you look not one girl as said anything on this post only worried producers siding up to each other making jokes.

The funny thing is i had a guy today say to me he did not know we even used condoms & is a member of our site etc, we don't advertise the fact & to be honest people don't really notice or care as its the sex scene they are interested in.

[fayerampton]

Black lists only work if the word came up a girl was a junkie alcoholic crack addict and even then I can bet some producer will want to work with her because of it. Probably because she'll do everything and looks like she loves it

I've seen that happen too

Look how many no shows are mentioned but producers stil go ahead and work with them?

As for girls not commenting on this, its always the way. They rarely ever comment on things that involve them because they are only interested in getting work.

Ive not met a model that was afraid to tell me their limits or they'd all be doing anal and dp scenes and working to extreme US strength !happy!

Not many girls are doing that these days so thats a good case in point. Our girls arent afraid to talk at all. They simply dont get involved

[Lucy_Love]

This is my opinion as a performer. It is not like I've entered this industry completely oblivious to the risks. I am well aware that certs are not an 100% guarentee, but I think it is my (the performers) choice as to whether or not I work and who I work with, my health is my own responsibilty.
Whilst condoms may offer a higher rate of protection, I agree with Jim when he says it will only take a 'mishap' for them (whoever is involved passing the legislations) to attempt further restrictions on the industry.
Kim, I don't know what all your scenes involve, I take it your scenes don't have CIM? I was curious, with the facials, has there ever been a situation where spunk has accidentally got into the eye, nose or mouth? What action is taken or would you take if this happened?
It is an indivduals choice if they want to work with condoms and a producers choice if they want condom only scenes. You can argue the benefits and disavantages all you like people will still and have the right to do what they like (in the U.K anyway).

[Paul Taylor]

Personally I shoot mainly with certs or rather I am certed every 30 days.

However because I shoot a lot of new talent I do sometimes use condoms on shoots.

The reason for this is, the new girls are usually that clueless that even though I bring up that they should get certed for our shoot, the just want to try their hand at porn and get the money.

I have had girls say that they will get certed and even give me a date they are going in, only for me to ask how did it go and then they say something came up......

So rather than not shoot a fresh face I get them to come in anyway and for that reason I shoot them with condom, which again since my site is aimed at new girls supposedly being conned into doing porn, the condom thing I guess adds a level of realism to the reality documentary style stuff I shoot.

However because the amount of condom porn I shoot is very small, I have no idea what the sales are like, I.E good or bad.

I do know that a new girl I shot called Bunni, it was shot with condoms and her single scenes have all most over sold any known model or other new face on the site, and that had a condom in the scene. So when I have scenes that dont featured condoms the most popular video on the site is suing a condom, so what does that say????

I think sex wise it isn't as bad as you think, but oral with a condom which is what you would have to do for uncerted or certed people if you are doubling up on safely as some have put it, looks bad.

Blowjobs in porn with a condom worn are pointless and that will suffer sales.

If you are certed and like to use condoms too, then doing it without a condom for oral and then slipping one on for the sex, isn't going to be any safer is it?

If the reason you are doubling up in the first place is for extra piece of mind then why do people do oral without a condom or allow cumshots near the face???

For the stuff I shoot its cum swallowing/cum in mouth or facials so everyone on board has to be ok with certs even if they dont have them selves as they have to trust in my certs and again nothing is 100% we know the risk, are choosing to do it as we are being as safe as we can and god forbid if that day ever comes where someone gets something bad, then if that person is certed and it happens people or the individual themselves will just think they are unlucky and were as safe as they good be. I worry about my own health and don't try to worry about other peoples, they will shoot how they feel comfortable certed or with condoms at the end of the day.

[videokim]

We use condoms for intercourse scenes vaginal/anal like they do is France & soon most of America, we still have the normal cum scenes (without condoms) like these countries do in regards to facials/cim etc.
Yes there is still a risk you might say but as long as the people involved have their monthly cert & use condoms it keep risks to a minimum.
If we do bukkakes girls always where sunglasses or clear glasses as spunk in the eyes are a direct route to the blood stream so it can be as dangerous as vaginal/anal sex unprotected where as the mouth is much safer unless you have ulcers or bleeding gums.
You can wear seat belts & get killed but we wear them as an extra precaution,
as certs are not as safe as we would want them condoms give that extra help.
Yes condoms can split & you have certs as a backup.
In 15 years we have never come across anyone catching anything orally...yes it can happen but its rare...well for us in our film making network.

[one eyed jack]

I hate to see producers kicking each other in the shins on issues but it reminds me that both sides are passionate and defensive about their claims.

Kim I applaud the effort you put into sexual health awareness but dont think yourself alone in fighting the good fight

Just today I was out filming Anna Span who Ive considered to be an activist in matters of all things sex for some time now but that goes unmentioned on here because not many people actually kbow what she does.

I also know of an ex producer who has made generous donations to childrens charities ton but kept it on the down low because of his involvement with the adult industry.

The point Im trying to make is that between us actually making porn and making a living that some of us are actually involved with things we beleive will hopefully shape future decisions that will facilitate our business

Bringing this back round: What are we going to do if this challenge does arise where we are being dictated to and forced by law to comply?

Are we going to take it lying down and bury our heads in the sand or are we going to align ourselves withthe various campaigns for free speech to have a say and do something about it?

Its the not doing anything about it that makes it easy for these lobbyists to use porn to further their agendas and before long you have to comply with some new law and get a letter warning you that what you are doing is illegal. Its almost like a McCarthy witch hunt. I only make films with people fucking. I'm not Osama Bin fucking Laden!!!!

What is so wrong with that?

The point is if you wont defend it then the rules will be made in your absence. Its as simple as that. If this is your business then you should do something about it and put a face to the faceless and not expect one or two individuals to do it for you because they will be expecting the same

We all have our part to play. The fans too.