Thatcher kept ravenscraig open - it was John Major that closed it.....
Thatcher took the unions to task and removed thier powers.....
sympathy strikes ?
Lady Thatcher
Re: Lady Thatcher
The amount of hysterical outpourings from people that were too young to be around when Thatcher did her bit. Its understandable when you see the amount of tripe that is being spouted about her policies now....
Thatcher did what was required and she worked hard at sorting out the ills of years of labour government. Yet again we are having to pick up the pieces of a monumental labour mess.....
Thatcher did what was required and she worked hard at sorting out the ills of years of labour government. Yet again we are having to pick up the pieces of a monumental labour mess.....
-
David Johnson
- Posts: 7844
- Joined: Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:40 am
Re: Firefly 2
"Part of the current problem is world wide and we have no control over. The second is the mess the Labour Party left us with"
Did you ever wonder how according to the Tories, the GLOBAL financial collapse affecting the likes of the US, Ireland, UK, Iceland, Spain, Portugal, Greece, Italy, Cyprus etc etc. was down to the Labour government and yet according to the same people, the UK doing worse in the last 3 years than any G20 country apart from Italy, rising debit, rising deficit, complete failure to keep to the plans to reduce the deficit, no growth whatsoever, rising long term unemployment, downgrading of the credit rating is down entirely to Jonny Foreigner?
Did it ever for a split second cause you to think "There is something a wee bit dodgy about the Tory line on all this?"
Did you ever wonder how according to the Tories, the GLOBAL financial collapse affecting the likes of the US, Ireland, UK, Iceland, Spain, Portugal, Greece, Italy, Cyprus etc etc. was down to the Labour government and yet according to the same people, the UK doing worse in the last 3 years than any G20 country apart from Italy, rising debit, rising deficit, complete failure to keep to the plans to reduce the deficit, no growth whatsoever, rising long term unemployment, downgrading of the credit rating is down entirely to Jonny Foreigner?
Did it ever for a split second cause you to think "There is something a wee bit dodgy about the Tory line on all this?"
-
tommy dickfingers
- Posts: 451
- Joined: Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:40 am
Re: tommy
In the 4 years harold wilson was prime minister 240 mines were closed,in the 11 years thatcher was in charge 154 were closed!
Re: Lady Thatcher
Maybe Harold was able to deploy and implement a plan which achieved the closures necessary without confrontation and conflict whilst still realising his objective which was to close-down those mines.
Makes you think doesn't it?
Makes you think doesn't it?
-
David Johnson
- Posts: 7844
- Joined: Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:40 am
William/Firefly
"Thatcher did what was required and she worked hard at sorting out the ills of years of labour government."
Yeah she did so well and was regarded so highly that the Labour opposition had to do nothing to get rid of her.
The Tory cabinet did it for the Labour opposition. Can't recall Cameron referring to that in his speech eulogising Thatcher in the Commons. Pity that it took the Tory cabinet 11 years to realise what the Labour party knew instinctively - she was a disaster.
At least Tebbit had the guts to tell the truth "I regret leaving Margaret to the mercy of her friends".
Yeah she did so well and was regarded so highly that the Labour opposition had to do nothing to get rid of her.
The Tory cabinet did it for the Labour opposition. Can't recall Cameron referring to that in his speech eulogising Thatcher in the Commons. Pity that it took the Tory cabinet 11 years to realise what the Labour party knew instinctively - she was a disaster.
At least Tebbit had the guts to tell the truth "I regret leaving Margaret to the mercy of her friends".
Re: Lady Thatcher
Harold Wilson closed 290 pits in six years
Thatcher closed 160 mines in 11 years......
in 1983 a tonne of scottish coal cost ?14 more than what it could be sold for - in the UK the loss was ?7 a tonne - this was refelcted in increased costs for power which in turn impacted the cost of manufacturing - this priced us out the markets we were trying to compete in.
Thatcher closed Racesncraig ? Nope - she kept it open in 82 and 85 injecting money to keep it running - and committined more money to the site to maintain it as a going concern. J Major closed it in 1992 -
Due to Scargill the miners union split into two - the miners were not even happy with striking as quite a few saw the hudden politics.
Scottish manufacturing was 7.5 percent higher when thatcher left office. FACT.
T Blair and G Brown decimated manufacturing and when G Brown was defeated it had fallen well below the level that Thatcher left it at 20 years previous.
The british car industry export more cars than it ever has in its history - getting rid of bad union practice helped. No union should be untoucable or unanswerable...
Poll tax ? Thatcher never wanted to introduce it seperately - she wanted it in one go across the country - if she had then it would still be there. No the scottish office ministers ballsed it up and convinced her to introduce it a year early.
Thatcher beat Labour three times in a row and never ever lost an election - she was remarkable and she dragged this country out of the dark ages.
Thatcher closed 160 mines in 11 years......
in 1983 a tonne of scottish coal cost ?14 more than what it could be sold for - in the UK the loss was ?7 a tonne - this was refelcted in increased costs for power which in turn impacted the cost of manufacturing - this priced us out the markets we were trying to compete in.
Thatcher closed Racesncraig ? Nope - she kept it open in 82 and 85 injecting money to keep it running - and committined more money to the site to maintain it as a going concern. J Major closed it in 1992 -
Due to Scargill the miners union split into two - the miners were not even happy with striking as quite a few saw the hudden politics.
Scottish manufacturing was 7.5 percent higher when thatcher left office. FACT.
T Blair and G Brown decimated manufacturing and when G Brown was defeated it had fallen well below the level that Thatcher left it at 20 years previous.
The british car industry export more cars than it ever has in its history - getting rid of bad union practice helped. No union should be untoucable or unanswerable...
Poll tax ? Thatcher never wanted to introduce it seperately - she wanted it in one go across the country - if she had then it would still be there. No the scottish office ministers ballsed it up and convinced her to introduce it a year early.
Thatcher beat Labour three times in a row and never ever lost an election - she was remarkable and she dragged this country out of the dark ages.
-
David Johnson
- Posts: 7844
- Joined: Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:40 am
William
"Harold Wilson closed 290 pits in six years
Thatcher closed 160 mines in 11 years.....".
You can't have it both ways. On the one hand you argue that the trade unions were all powerful until Thatcher came along and sorted them out. If we take your figures at face value, then clearly, the trade unions under Harold Wilson were far from all powerful, eh?
There is, of course, a difference between closing mines down because they have run out of coal, something that happened regularly in the Durham coalfield in the 60s and 70s and mines that still had substantial quantities of coal that were closed down largely for political reasons.
"in 1983 a tonne of scottish coal cost ?14 more than what it could be sold for - in the UK the loss was ?7 a tonne - this was refelcted in increased costs for power which in turn impacted the cost of manufacturing - this priced us out the markets we were trying to compete in."
Your homework question is to work out whether it is better to encourage home grown energy producers as opposed to a reliance on utility companies and energy providers that are owned by overseas companies e.g Russian owned? Do you open your energy bills and think "What a wonderful thing it was that Maggie privatised the utilities?
"Thatcher closed Racesncraig ? Nope - she kept it open in 82 and 85 injecting money to keep it running - and committined more money to the site to maintain it as a going concern. J Major closed it in 1992 -"
A tad selective in your choice of facts, WIlliam. Thatcher had privatised British Steel four years earlier, paving the way for the shutdown. And while European governments supported their steel industries to help them compete against cheap imports, the Tories stood by and let Ravenscraig go to the wall.
"Scottish manufacturing was 7.5 percent higher when thatcher left office. FACT."
Yes, I suspect that this is why she is held in such high regard by the Scottish people that lived through Thatcherism. I would guess there is going to be a constant stream of coaches going down the M6 and M1 to allow people to pay their respects next Wednesday.
!wink!
Thatcher closed 160 mines in 11 years.....".
You can't have it both ways. On the one hand you argue that the trade unions were all powerful until Thatcher came along and sorted them out. If we take your figures at face value, then clearly, the trade unions under Harold Wilson were far from all powerful, eh?
There is, of course, a difference between closing mines down because they have run out of coal, something that happened regularly in the Durham coalfield in the 60s and 70s and mines that still had substantial quantities of coal that were closed down largely for political reasons.
"in 1983 a tonne of scottish coal cost ?14 more than what it could be sold for - in the UK the loss was ?7 a tonne - this was refelcted in increased costs for power which in turn impacted the cost of manufacturing - this priced us out the markets we were trying to compete in."
Your homework question is to work out whether it is better to encourage home grown energy producers as opposed to a reliance on utility companies and energy providers that are owned by overseas companies e.g Russian owned? Do you open your energy bills and think "What a wonderful thing it was that Maggie privatised the utilities?
"Thatcher closed Racesncraig ? Nope - she kept it open in 82 and 85 injecting money to keep it running - and committined more money to the site to maintain it as a going concern. J Major closed it in 1992 -"
A tad selective in your choice of facts, WIlliam. Thatcher had privatised British Steel four years earlier, paving the way for the shutdown. And while European governments supported their steel industries to help them compete against cheap imports, the Tories stood by and let Ravenscraig go to the wall.
"Scottish manufacturing was 7.5 percent higher when thatcher left office. FACT."
Yes, I suspect that this is why she is held in such high regard by the Scottish people that lived through Thatcherism. I would guess there is going to be a constant stream of coaches going down the M6 and M1 to allow people to pay their respects next Wednesday.
!wink!
Re: Liverpool too...
Now I see clearly there are no morals left in this country.
I wonder if those same Liverpool fans singing in your video, would be okay with singing the lyrics from the re-wording of Nena's song, from the 80's.
'96 Red Buffoons'
I highly doubt it.
After this week's antics, I'll never again show any sympathy towards any of the groups of society that have partied in the street and/or promoted the wizard of oz song, to celebrate the death of an 87 year old woman. Before she's even been laid to rest. It's a fucking national disgrace.
I wonder if those same Liverpool fans singing in your video, would be okay with singing the lyrics from the re-wording of Nena's song, from the 80's.
'96 Red Buffoons'
I highly doubt it.
After this week's antics, I'll never again show any sympathy towards any of the groups of society that have partied in the street and/or promoted the wizard of oz song, to celebrate the death of an 87 year old woman. Before she's even been laid to rest. It's a fucking national disgrace.