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Okay, watched this tonight on Channel 4 for the first time (such things seldom get to the multiplexes in the sticks), having only seen a couple of Michael Moore's Channel 4 programmes before and read two of his books. I was willing to agree with Bimmercat's claims of him persecuting the Alzheimer's suffering Holywood star---but it didn't pan out that way. To appear at one gun rally after a school shooting, virtually the equivalent of standing on the bodies of the dead students, might seem insensitive; to do it twice shows a flagrant disregard for the feelings of your fellow Americans. But, hey, so long as Chuck feels safe with his loaded guns around his fortified home in that major crime capital Beverly Hills, so what!

Being a documentary means it had a point of view, and it could have just pushed that view all the way. But it didn't. Moore spoke to people in the
Michigan Militia and the NRA and got their views.

Plus, and this was heavily emphasised, Canada has millions of guns in public ownership, its laws aren't that strict on the sale of firearms, and yet there is nowhere near the percentage of gun murders that there is further south. I got the impression Moore was looking for answers, as well as aiming at the corporate and media types that feed fear and rely on fear in the United States. Propaganda, possibly; but at least he is asking questions that need asking, and letting the people involve have their say rather than assuming he knows what they want or need.

Scary, thought-provoking, and --- if Britain is in danger of following America's lead with regard politicians thinking they speak for the people and the broadcast media dumbing down news reporting and only showing "sexy" footage and what the various spin doctors want reporting --- more than a little worrying.

I too thought Moore scored several hits: I don't know enough to judge whether he was overly 'selective' in his choice of interviewees, but the overall impression I got was of a caring and committed man trying to fathom some of the problems in his society (and about on the vituperative level of Mark Thomas here, say) rather than the Right-bashing maniac he has been characterised as by some.
The Canadian comparison had me mystified, too. Why the US and not them? I could posit the British influence, but without any evidence to back it up !! And then I'd possibly have to credit the French too, and that ain't gonna happen..........

The fear factor doesn't really work either since many people escaped oppression in their own countries by going to Australia, Canada and New Zealand, as well as the US. Yet the impression was given of an almost paranoid aspect to the American psyche that "they" were coming for you (whoever "they" were and whatever "they" represent).

I was pleased to see it went beyond the guns good/guns bad debate.

I'll concur, although I would've preferred a more concentrated portrait of Columbine in place of the free-range politicking, and a few niggles were jarring: emo button-pushing, haphazard edits, botched use of Columbine footage (the animated history of USA was uproarious, however). Certainly whets the appetite for his next two: Fahrenheit 9/11, and Sicko (american mental health treatment).

--
"Let's do it..."

caractacus - even i managed to see BFC at the cinema in norwich and u cant say norfolks not out in the sticks lol.

getting to the point - i thought it was somewhat ironic that michael moore started the doc off with how he had been an excellent rifleman as a teenager and still a member of the NRI to this day seemed a little ironic given his general subject matter was criticising the fact that everyone has guns! surely he is just as bad as the rest of them in that sense.

it was hilarious in the cinema tho i have to say, the comedy moments were hilarious...that guy saying he was expelled for 380 days or..."no wait 165....whichever there is in a school year" lmaoooo.....i think we can all work that one out for ourselves. but everyone pissed themselves at moments like that and then it fell silent for scenes like the one that ended with the 9-11 plane attacks...

who cares, i wanna live in oz or canada so....fuck em if they dont wanna be helped

actually at times it ALMOST....allllmost inspired me to wanna make documentaries but ..haha.. i can't be arsed after all

Hey, the thought was there, ID. Fenland Features presents . . . Norfolk Broads.

Hehe. I'm trying to predict Bimmercat's reply.

Mart

lol hands off the norfolk broads! they kick ass nah i looove research and the research gone into that kind of documentary really gets me going. gotta admit - its a fantastically interesting film not just 2 hours of columbine which makes it really entertaining, especially matt stones contribution of that cartoon.hilarious

And his contribution as the same sort of belittled, put-upon geek that the killers were (he channelled his frustrations creatively), and the suggestion of the pressure put on young children. To think that at ten or 11 the schools (and parents) are ready to write you off as a loser is depressing. Some people, though not stupid, react negatively to that kind of pressure; some just take a few years to find their emotional balance. If we're going to suggest that people have no future before they even begin secondary school, we're as well going the whole genetic engineering, Brave New World route.

So much in this world is centred on the notion of success---almost always material success. Sorry, but if that involves working 70 hours a day, sacrificing another four hours commuting to and from work, or being at the constant beck and call of employer or contacts via the "devil's handset," then rule me out. The lifestyle of Fulton Mackay's character in Local Hero looked much more appealing!

Oh, and no disrespect to the fair East Anglian fillies, ID! I just thought you might enjoy the research