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That's a great post!
I attempted to make the same point a few days ago but didn't put it anywhere near as well and ended up being called a perv.
Well done on finding the time and having the inclination to post it.

i don't normally agree with, or like comments from, the previous poster to me, but i do agree with his sentiments today.

Some interesting and perceptive observations Mike.

"Most pornographers are voyeurs and "punters" themselves."

Hence the extreme, irrelevant, self indulgence of some producers nowadays. They?re not bothered (or it's probably never registered in their heads) that ordinary Joe's, on the whole, have ordinary tastes that probably don't venture to far over the frontier of fucking and sucking with an attractive lady. Your right, producers are doing it for themselves, and when you point this fact out to them they metaphorically clasp their hands to their ears and loudly hum a cheerful tune. Or, they try to justify themselves with some pseudo-artistic ?pushing the boundaries? tosh as though women and their bodies are some kind of Everest to be quad-mega-butt-fucked and jizzed on, just because they are there. But who do they imagine would be impressed by this? Surely they cannot be so out of touch with reality that they imagine the guy on the Clapham omnibus will dig it? Nah, they're just doing it for themselves, their porn producer colleagues, and rivals who speak the same ?Planet Porno? language.

"There is a sea change in the public's moral attitude towards it."

Yes, the change is that now there is no moral attitude towards it. Nobody gives a toss about anything or anyone anymore (He says, trying not to sound like a Tory Backbencher.) Tory backbenchers would say, "Standards of decency have been thrown out of the window!" I?m not to bothered about standards of decency. What concerns me are standards of quality. Standards that in almost all areas of adult entertainment have now been dispensed with.

"People are sick of violent films and want more and more porn."

Hmm, don't know about that Mike. There's nothing I like better than curling up with my classic copies of 'Predator, Scarface, Goodfellas and the like. Beats the shit out of 'Tirsome Slappas From Wigan Being Half-Heartedly Shagged In Their Council Flat - Part Umpteen?, which is the kind of thing that is universally served up as erotica nowadays.

"Women are treated more equally now that they have been brought down off the romantic pedestal and a lot of men have realised that women are just like men when it comes to sex"

A particularly interesting observation Mike. I agree, though I don't think the resulting status quo has been beneficial at all - particularly for people in our line of biz. Now that women have been brought down off their pedestals and are being treated like geezers (and acting the part) geezers have lost interest. Guys were only interested before because girls were soft, fascinating, exotically beautiful alien creatures, so different from themselves - which is what fuelled many adult entertainment success stories like the early Fiona Cooper ? just for instance. Now that girls can act as obnoxious and raucous as geezers, and have decided they don't have to bother wearing nice clothes or fixing their make-up for anyone, geezers have lost interest, big time. Hence the decline of many adult entertainment staples. Yes, we knew women had the same level of sexual desire as guys, but when they were obliged to act with a level of decorum befitting the ?fairer sex' they deployed it with so much more imagination, class and style. I don?t know. Call me a weirdo if you will, but I don?t want my prospective sex partner to be ?just like? a man.

I?m all for sexual freedom and the like, but let?s stow the rose tinted specs. Not everything has turned out wonderful in the adult entertainment garden.


Officer D ? Puttin? a dampener on it.


P.S. Got the latest video and DVD release covers from PrimeTime today. AAARRRGGHH! They?re fuckin? horrible! All gapping-assed scrawny slappas who, seemingly, don?t own a hairbrush between them and can?t afford an appointment at the hairdresser. I binned the lot. I?m not insulting my punters...

Point Taken Dibb's....
But tell me, my Idea has always been " Take a nice cute plain girl, do her make-up/hair choose a sexy but classy outfit, put on some token classy jewlery. create a woman who you would seen in the street and think Shit who is she, she is famous, is she a model, is she an actress, is she a pop star, she has to be someone....Create the peak.....then you speak with her....she is shy but has confidence, you coment on how good she looks, she could be a model !. She gets a bit embaresed but tells you she is not but has always wanted to be, you talk her into coming back to your studio, as an amatuer photographer you could take a few pictures of her....In your home she relaxes as you shoot a few nice pictures, with your encouragement she show you a bit sexier poses, this is when you find she is wareing very nice underware, stockings very tiny panties. You tell her she is beautiful this encourages her to go a bit further. She begins stroking the outside of her panties and tweeking her nipples for you, things speed up she tells you she has always wanted to play for a camera but frightend someone would find out and she would loose her job or her family would find out. She asks you to film her but with no tape in the camera, so she can feel safe and let go.
You agree, the second you say action she changes, she is so horny she does everything for you, she ends up with 4 fingers in her pussy and then, she slips a finger in her own ass, this sends her over the edge she looks at you as she orgasms,,,,her mouth opens and she she says please come and fuck me I need some cock.....she fiks your brains out she does every position you have seen in a porn movie, then she asks "I have never had a cock in my ass but I want it, I want this porno movie we are making to be the best so please put it in my ass" you do she changes personallity again now she is like a tramp/whore/slut her shyness has all gone she is swearing/sweating her face is covered in messy make-up. She is doing things you never knew excisted. you have created the bottom peak..

....Ok enough is enough I will leave the rest and where you put the come up to yourselves..

Point is FIK SAKE tell me I am a producer is this what you you want or do you want a teenie scrubber getting two cocks up her ass. This forum is an ideal way to tell us what the punters want, but they never tell us. Sometimes its only the minority of complainers that get heard, while the true punters are quiet,,,Speak up lad,

Phil McC

there's a ways to go yet... the longest ever thread on the main forum has 144 posts to it's credit.

interestingly, although it was posted almost a year ago it's very relevant to the topic of this thread:

"Women are treated more equally now that they have been brought down off the romantic pedestal and a lot of men have realised that women are just like men when it comes to sex"

I found this statement interesting too but from a different perspective. I particularly welcome the fact that some people may at last recognise that women are just like men when it comes to sex (at least in the sense of having a sexual appetite - tastes on the other hand may, or may not, still differ). How many millenia did that one take?

The problem for me is if that's the case how few pornographers seem to have really grasped the implications of this fact. Most of them still seem to be in the stone age - hit the woman with this big thing, maul her a bit, and then just fuck whichever hole presents itself. My problem is that many of these videos seem to lack any finesse or eroticism. I really would love to see women in said videos really expressing their sexuality - taking control, showing how horny they are, what I get off on most is seeing the woman's excitement - mainly because for me (as maybe for many punters) porn is just an extension of my sex life - I get turned on when a woman openly reciprocates my lust - I get turned on when she tells me what she wants me to with to her - and I get turned on by the finer details of the sex play - the games, kissing (now where did that dissapear to?) the intimacy, the passion. I see precious little of that in a lot of the porn we seem to have inflicted on us by these so called "erotic artists". If there is an acceptance that women are "as horny as men" (and I feel like a dinasaur just saying that) then let's see more of that in porn - images of women being forced into sex, abused, raped, spat on etc present entirely the opposite message. That, and the fact that they are so boringly routine these days, makes such movies a complete turn off. I am not at all opposed to anal or dp's etc per se - in fact I get off on a lot of these things too - its the context I'm on about mainly, within an erotic and sensual context they are fun, but presented as part of a ritual of aggression and degradation they are not.

I have never been an advocate of censorship - it annoys me that everytime we punters start to say "I don't like the way things are heading" you get someone pulling out that arguement. What is wrong with saying what we like and don't like - its not saying everyone has to agree or like the same thing, merely that for me (and maybe quite a few others) the industry seems to have lost it's way in many respects. Censorship means the government taking control of what we do because they believe we can not take responsibility for ourselves as adults. If we have responsibility for ourselves then it is perfectly legitimate to question and debate these sort of issues, it's not a call for censorship to do such things, it's part of being adult, to ask ourselves what are we doing? Porn is still in it's infancy in many respects - we have these hard won freedoms, but we still haven't much idea of what to do with them.

I've just noticed you're post. I don't know if I've got the wrong impression, but I don't think anyone has a problem with anal sex. It is the brutal depiction which I have the problem with. I wholeheartedly agree with your views on censorship and if we lived in a civilised society that wasn't inhabited with killers, rapists and abusers, it would be fine to depict anything you wanted in any way, because we'd draw on our pipes, take a deep breath and say, "What a wonderful piece of art that is, that girl being raped, abused and brutalised, wouldn't it be absolutely awful if we lived in a society where that really happened!"
Unfortunately, I think there is a tangible risk, that a psychopath could be influenced by what he sees depicted in a porn film and as a director, I wouldn't want to take the slightest risk.
I think in a normal, feature film, the depiction of this kind of thing is more abstract, whereas in porn/gonzo, it could appear too real.
I'm not advocating more censorship by the state, just a little self-censorship.

that was a wrestler from CZW called the 'messiah' , just in case anyone wanted to know.

Great scenario Phil with generally one slight problem in the UK...chances are the reality of the final line would be along the lines of "F' FIK SAKE, are you gonna stick yer cock up me arse or what!"