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[MAI Productions]

Hear Hear Charlie,

You make the point very well. All our stuff goes through BBFC, as has Rob's always done so to suggest such a blatant criminal act as Cement or Guns is just plain silly.

Such wild and small suggestions do not really justify a response

[Dickie Davies]

I disagree Charlie. The issue here (as has been seen in the US and Eastern Europe) is that some girls are prepared to go a very long way. Some people get turned on by girls being sick and there is some sort of market - if a girl is prepared to do this, and some do, should we object? I would say yes, Charlie's argument appears to be no.

Here in Britain it is just five or six years since it became legal to buy any sort of hardcore porn. Before that we were reduced to trying to smuggle even straightforward Private stuff through the ports or hope we would get it past customs through the post.

As well as what individual girls will go for, and what people beleive there is a market for, I believe it is a matter for society to decide what it believes is acceptable. Until R18 became legal, society here decided hardcore sex should not be seen on videos in the UK. Look at last ear's consultation by OFCOM on R18 showin on TV.

We are an awful long way from - if the girl will do it and there is some sort of market, let's shoot it. Bob's cement argument may be a bit over the top, but not much. As a few of us have said so far, the BBFC has the experience and responsibility to make these pretty big and quite philosphical decisions on all of our behalfs - taking into account the girls who will do almost everything through, the art argument right through to the opinions of those men and women who still believe Page 3 is pornographic (and they still exist and they defeated us on R18 on TV.)

You must apprecate that if you are getting such a hard time from a few porn fans here then things could get much hotter still "outside". To use an extreme example, I can't see several tabloids buying the "the girls will do it and there's a market" argument. I can see them running a - we bought this DVD at our neighbourhood porn shop and isn't it terrible line.

Think on this - if an element of UK porn goes "extreme", what happens if/when we get a Government with a big element that still worships at the altar of Mary Whitehouse? While the courts allowed today's R18, there is a lot a negative Government could do to turn the clock back and extreme stuff could give them just the justification they would be looking for.

Anyway, you probably already thought of this and you do of course have every right to test the system. We'll see what the BBFC says.



Charlie Holays said -

The future of British porn, as I said earlier, will depend on how far the girls are willing go. There is a market for everything in this industry and of course, a director willing to shoot it. There will always be girls who enjoy doing hard things and guys who enjoy watching it. But you know really, it?s not going to get much harder than it is already. It doesn?t matter how much customers request something like, I dunno, quadruple anal, they aint gonna get it unless there is a girl willing to do it. To be honest, if it were to cause someone extreme pain or physical harm, then no-one in the right mind would do anything like that. We all work to levels we feel comfortable, and no amount of money will make a girl take a job she doesn?t want to do. Talk of cement and guns, come on now, grow up boys!!

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[EMPREX]

I have been reading all this with great interest and one thing strikes me as very odd.

The dvd market is dying a slow and agonising death as everyone in the industry knows or should know. Yet movies like this are getting made and by all accounts judging by the amount of talent a lot was spent on this movie. Now either somone somewhere is making a shedload of cash from dvds ( god knows how) or this movie was made to satisfy someones ego as to be the hardest uk porn film out there for what reason nothing more than vanity me thinks

I,m sure all the models were paid very well..hell Rob himself was on here preaching about how much more models should get paid and is it any wonder when they take screwdrivers in the ass or get covered in oil etc of course they should be well paid to do that.

I look at it like this i doubt any model who was on that shoot didnt have a great time however long it took to shoot but i bet in five years time when there ass is dropping out or they have got something wrong with there bowels etc they wont think it so great then.

I,m all for pushing boundries but trying to re invent the wheel with porn like this isnt going to work for one thing our US counterparts will look at this movie and think 'hey look there trying to do what we been doing for the last ten years THEY CAUGHT up at last'

Can someone explain to me what is sexy about drinking milk out of your own ass or another models??? and as for lots of interest and pre orders i dont know what you call LOTS but i would imagine about 20 people maximum are interested in buying this dvd and say 15 will part with cash for it then pirate the fuck out of it!

UK porn has the best thing in the world without this kind of shit and do you know what that is???

SEXY HOMEGROWN FEMALE TALENT why do you think UK girls do so well in the US??? because they/we love that cheeky,sexy girl from next door done better than any european girl or US girl

end of rant

EMPREX

[EMPREX]

Let me get this straight Mr Stone i remind you of a council estate villain & i,m the only idiot who has posted on this topic??

No Sir i may not make blisttering try to reinvent the wheel porn or boost my ego by making such movies BUT everything i posted is a FACT you know i know it and most of the people who read it will know it too.

Its so funny that you would attack somone who was not having a go at you personally but stating FACTS!! or are you telling me some of the things in your gracious film wont have any lasting effect on any model that was in it??? Nay you will say because of course you paid them well with other peoples money and if they do have any lasting effect you wont be bothered,be there to nurse them thru or give a rats ass really now will you??

Remember your posts about paying models higher rates?? which i am all for but now i see WHY you made such posts because if your making such movies then you HAVE to pay higher rates dont you!!! does that make me an idiot or stating FACTS!

I wish you and everyone involved all the luck in the world with your masterpeice i,m sure you,ll sell a couple hundred copies & be noted as the top extreme director in the UK a gong you so clearly want very badly

You remind me of a schoolboy no one used to speak to so to get attention you stole fags and shared them out to get friends...not a snipe just an observation

EMPREX

[Bob Singleton]

Rob, many thanks for your lengthy and well reasoned argument... well almost well-reasoned.

You said "I aim my comments at Bob mostly, because I have to confess that I do disapprove totally of his industry too"

I'm not sure what you think I do, but I certainly don't run a prostitution ring as you seem to imply. I run an adult entertainment agency that supplies strippers for stag and hen nights, adult cabaret acts (stripping magicians, belly dancers, novelty male strip shows like The Oddballs, etc) and blue comedians. So why the "I don't care for your business Bob, but anyone involved with it has every right to make their choice to do it." ??? Is it because I've chosen to allow about 10 independant escorts to promote themselves on my website? Forget the 200+ strippers, comedians, etc., listed, it's the escorts who don't even work for me that count in your book!

You also said:

"Bob I?m sorry that you believe that there is someone out there capable of tipping cement down a girls vagina or putting a gun inside it and pulling a trigger. It?s certainly not me. Nor anyone I know. But even if there were such a person, your whole argument of ?what next? is cancelled out by the most obvious obstacle, you seem to have overlooked. The law."

Firstly I'm not as naieve as you... yes I *do* believe there is someone out there capable of such acts (people are being tortured everyday somewhere in the world... many of the acts even more grotesque than what you film)... however, I was using them as an example as to just where we go from here. MAI said his films were customer driven. I asked, if enough customers asked for that would he film it?

Secondly, your argument about the law is a fatuous one. Are you saying that until recently when porn was legally available in licenced sex shops no one in this country had made, sold or distributed porn because the law forbade it?

I'm sure all the girls were well paid and well looked after, and that everyone involved had a great time and enjoyed themselves. My concern is that your audience will soon bore of what you are producing and ask you to go further. Now, you may well decide you've gone as far as you can, but there will always be someone else who will think, "I can top that!" And because you helped pave the way, you are in part responsible.

[GG]

Hi everyone,

I don't usually get involved in these discussions, but I do on this occassion feel the need...

As a fellow pornographer, my view of this trailer is that it shows imagination and talent. It's well put together, well thought out and the girls have a real fire in their bellies...you don't perform with such passion unless you are under good direction are are enjoying what you're doing.

As a woman I do not find it offensive or abusive as all the girls Rob/Donna have filmed agreeded to take part and as they have said enjoyed the making of the film.

Yes it's extreme, yep it's not everyone's cup of tea...but that's CHOICE you have a choice - you can watch it or not- that's what's so great about living in today's society...or would you rather be told what you should be turned on by, no thanks!

[WhiteR]

Rob. I?m not overly keen on your trailer, but it?s nothing the likes of Max Hardcore hasn?t done before. How many people in this forum have observed HIS work? And, what did everyone think? How many e-mails has Max taken from you guys, or is it that no one cares enough to search out his details (which I?m sure are listen in the AVN, and are also made available in each of his movies). Clearly you weren?t THAT shocked then.

For all of those people who are posting here, working in the industry and being appalled by what you?ve seen I would like to ask you a question ? is everything you?ve made / been involved with acceptable to all? For instance, there are a lot of people involved with exhibitionism. Did you consider what your average prude walking the street would have thought about this? Or, are you saying there is one rule for one, and another for other people? When you lock a ring of censorship around an industry there is only one way to go ? it gets tighter. Soon we will be back to the days where showing a nipple is seen as being criminal! I suggest you all take a look at yourselves and be supportive, whether you like it or not. No one wants to live in an oppressed nanny-state, so why cause such a stir? Especially when everyone on here is supposed to be OPEN-MINDED!! We?re the liberal ones, for heaven?s sake!!

Believe me, I wasn?t aroused at all by what I saw in the film and I had concerns about it. But at the end of the day, as Rob said, societies morals are dictated by laws, and the clips were passed by the correct governing bodies. Did they get it wrong? No! They went by their guidelines, which everyone knows are too restrictive already!! Everyone could gang together and appeal about what the film shows, but the only people who actually matter are the performers involved within these acts. What do they say? I?m pretty sure no one was forced, and despite the superior bigots who think they know better than anyone (no doubt those who haven?t heard of feminism and are ill-aware that women actually have their own minds and are NOT controlled by men) it?s only those performers who have the rights to speak out about the acts they were involved in.

Will this film corrupt society? To paraphrase a popular film, ?If wiping out pornography will put an end to all sexual ills in society, we?d do it tomorrow.? Obviously that wouldn?t happen, much as I?m sure not ONE person who saw the trailer will mimic the acts they saw in the video with their loved ones tonight. At the end of the day, those who want to try extreme sex are actually practising much worse than anything shown in THAT video!

[Michelle B]

Hi everyone!

I've heard a few things about this post so would just like to tell people my opinions. I've not seen the trailer until now and although my scene is pretty tame compared to the other scenes, I remember wanting my scene to be a bit rougher cos thats the way I like it! Sadly the male talent didn't get the message!

Theres a lot of stuff on the trailer I wouldn't have done, but I do know Rob, his wife and Donna are great to work for and anything you don't wanna do then they respect your wishes. I just wish my scene was a little raunchier!

Secondly, I don't think people really have to worry about scenes getting more & more extreme either. I think it's more likely that once people get bored of extreme stuff then they'll go back to softer porn rather than wanting to push the bounderies even further.

Anyway the scenes were proffessionally shot, they made the effort with the sets & lighting, paid for make-up artists, and booked some gorgeous talent! Surely thats a good thing?

I hope Donna does well with her directing and would definately work for them all again!

Michelle B xxx