Nelson Mandela has died....

[David Johnson]

"I thought the regime in South Africa was awful. but if you kill the oppressor does it make you a better human being?"

Yeah, you should give the oppressor a boiled sweet just before he shoots you.

[Cuntybollocks]

I will say it one more time on this thread, the man was a terrorist.

It is well documented that this is the case. I am not trying to be smart or clever.

Please accept the man for what he was and what he stood for. He was never a hero, but he did redeem part of himself to a cause.

[one eyed jack]

Heard you first time CB

I would say that serving 27 years behind bars could be seen as paying the price for that

So are his oppressors not seen as terrorists then? Or is it perhaps the oppressors divine right to oppress without expecting resistance from those they oppress?

I'm not trying to be clever too but its clear we interpret his actions in history differently

You said the man was a terrorist Surely that is a big difference to the "is a terrorist" A hero is defined by his achievements and i would say Mandela has earned his stripes for the work he has done since he was freed

[max_tranmere]

Militia groups do do things to advance publicity for their cause, and to make themselves known on the world stage, I agree. It was said that during the 1970s and 80s, at the height of the IRA's bombing campaign, they wanted to get into the Sunday newspapers more than newspapers on any other day - because in the Sunday broadsheets you don't just get coverage but a lot of analysis aswell, and politicians and scholars often spend hours reading the broadsheets on a Sunday. It was said that it was for this reason that most IRA bombs went off on a Thursday or a Friday.

The IRA, when they bombed London, would give a telephone warning so that (hopefully) no one would die, the attack would put pressure on the Government to bow to their demands, and it would also get them worldwide publicity - and it always did. The biggest bomb attack in British history (at the time) occurred the day after the general election in 1992. John Major was returned to office following the election on the Thursday and on Friday the IRA denoted a one ton bomb which was housed in the back of a lorry in the City of London. The Baltic Exchange and other buildings in that part of the City were destroyed, this got them worldwide coverage. The Gherkin now stands where the Baltic Exchange used to be. Three people died in that attack and the IRA released a statement the following day saying the three deaths were "regrettable". The IRA were given publicity across the entire world following that bomb attack, and also following their huge bomb attack on the City of London in 1993 and on Manchester in 1996.

I would regard the IRA, and Mandela & the ANC, as an army of freedom fighters if they had acted solely like one. Not killing their critics and if they solely attacked military installations, infrastructure, offices of State and so on. It's when groups start operating outside of that remit that they start being viewed, and justifiably so, as terrorists. The ANC were less terrorists than the IRA were. Often acts where civilians are killed actually set the organisation, and the people they are trying to help, back. Apparently after the Birmingham pub bombing in the 1970s, where the IRA killed 21 innocent people, there was a lot of anti-Irish feeling in Britain and a lot of hatred towards Irish people.

I wouldn't be surprised if after the ANC killed civilians in some of its attacks in South Africa, and they would have known that it was very likely civilians would die in many of those attacks, there would have been white people who didn't like black people disliking black people even more. That would not have been justified, but probably happened. So often the activities of groups is counter-productive. If you're forced to take up arms against your oppressor then solely target the oppressor, attack installations and State buildings, but give sufficient warnings so that every civilian has been evacuated from the surrounding area and so on. Also, and the IRA were not this, be able to take criticism. Because one person's terrorist is another person's freedom fighter we could have a situation where there is no such thing as a terrorist because there will always be people who view any particular group as freedom fighters. I think, as I've said, an objective take on it all is if you have a cause that most decent-thinking people would regard as a fair one, and you act exclusively like an army, then you are freedom fighters. Step out of that remit and you're a terrorist.

[Arginald Valleywater]

I am most pleased several hundred people complained about the left leaning PC BBC showing hours of coverage about Mandela and relegating the massive flood threat TO THE WHOLE OF THE EAST COAST to a minor item. British people pay their licence fees for quality news, not fawning over a dead terrorist with a murderer for an ex wife.

[spider]

Nelson Mandela and Margaret Thatcher

[David Johnson]

Do stop this silliness about the BBC and Nelson Mandela.

One of your lot, David Cameron, called Nelson Mandela "one of the greatest men alive" in 2006 and another of your political crushes Boris Johnson described the death of Mandela as "a great heart has been stilled".

Hardly noted for their leftie tendencies, those two, eh?

Now stop acting stupid, be quiet please and eat your tea.

[David Johnson]

"I am not trying to be smart or clever"

Maybe you should try?

Give it a go and let us know how you get on. !wink!

[Cuntybollocks]

There goes another rib.

[Arginald Valleywater]

DJ Go fuck yourself with a thermos flask. Unlike you I think people are allowed an opinion. I imagine you get your tea mashed up by the wardens in your padded cell...the one lined with your pictures of Stalin and Mao.