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...and thats how it should be Andy Handy

If I didnt know any better i would've thought the thread was one mans desire to feel superior belying the fact he feels powerless and inferior to start an incendiary thread like that but you know me...I'm probably shooting left of the mark again.

So one faux pas deserves another.

OEJ when I made my reply I wondered if that was the response he wanted.

I can't help wondering if the Ships hadn't arrived if 'Africa' would be in the state it is.

I personally think not but the thing about history is once it's happened it can rarely be changed.

Such a shame! I was looking forward to learning from you, Steve. You seem to have the answers I'm looking for and you don't seem inclined to share them with a willing, eager student! That's bad form, surely?

I didn't know you were the type to state theories without explaining your reasoning and method that brought you to such conclusions. Are you sure you were stating fact or did you forget to tell us it was just your opinion? Now, if it's just opinion then I'd feel much better about my line of thought regarding this matter because the chances of me being wrong would shoot up! You see, I thought my logic was all to-cock compared to your 'facts'.

To put my mind at rest, please confirm my suspicion that you were really just stating your opinion, Steve.

Yours, in apprehension....

Hi Randy Andy...You may well be right. i think Africa in the troubles it has had is as much to do with its own people as much as outside intervention as well...The corruption, the power mad and all the things that has torn that country apart.

Africa is an allegory for the human race. Its good and its bad elements.

Obama being the first black president is incidental. I wonder if he was a bona fide black man if he would have got in.

That train of thought is neither here nor there now. He's in. Lets just deal with it.

Steve R putting this thread up was going to stir up a hornets nest and Im not even clear as to what he is even getting at. I think I know but I could be wrong from my own biased point of view.

I'm still waiting for the punchline.

Am i wrong or weren't the Spanish and Portuguese way before us with slavery?

It's an attitude .. the will to power and the desire to subjugate others. It's not a systemic thing it's about how we relate to one another as human beings and whether or not we behave in a principled way.

R/A: there are a couple of good books on the subject of western imperialism, but for Africa I'd recommend Adam Hochschild's 'King Leopold's Ghost'.

But what do you think about Steve's theory, Reggie? Is Obama only in office due, partly, to slavery?

I like Obama but unsure about his name. It's not American enough for me. Maybe he should ditch the name and come back with a new alias, eh?

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