egafd.com

You say "Illegal for offshore business's to advertise within the UK and offer for sale via mail order ... ", but if these suppiers are genuinely outside the UK, they are outside the UK legal jurisdiction and cannot be prosecuted in the UK. I doubt the UK authorities would have any success in instigating extradition proceedures against the owners of a supplier from outside the UK, particularly from a country where porn is freely available.

Can you enlighten us on your interpretation?

Peter

I expected the topic to move to the top of the page. When it didn't I tried again. Then I noticed that Woodgnome has bagged the top spot for himself!

Peter

In the recent rulings Trading Standards argued that supplying or offering to supply material with a BBFC R18 classification is illegal anywhere other than in a licensed sex shop. This would apply to any company, whether they're in the UK or not. T/S are very unlikely to prosecute a non-UK company but they could prosecute any person or company based in the UK that had any commercial connection with the company that is supplying or offering to supply (i.e. aiding and abetting).

Trading Standards were fully aware of the "loophole" of offering R18's in the UK, then supplying them from elsewhere and they believe that their success against Pabo (who were doing exactly that) would allow them to go after anyone who is trying to do the same.

We have already been advised that UK companies that accept advertising for mail order / phone order of uncertificated or R18 movies are aiding and abetting the offence of sale of product outside of a licensed sex shop and therefore liable to prosecution with no exceptions for offshore companies advertising in the UK. That doesn't mean the offshore company will be prosecuted for placing the advertising but it does mean the advertisers accepting the advert are liable as they are aiding and abetting the offence.

Basically it has put us back 8 years as advertisers will now only accept BBFC 18 with copy of the certificate which can be legally mail ordered in the UK, which is what used to happen. The key to all this is the position or point of offering the product for sale and where that proprietor/company is based including re-sellers.

If it is the UK then start doing softcore versions of your programmes BBFC 18 for mail order and the R18 versions beg the R18 license holders to stock them.

None of this affects the purchasers rights to source their movies offshore and import them providing they are not classed as obscene within the R18 guidelines including R18 certificated. All it has screwed up is offshore companies/proprietors being legally allowed to advertise directly in the UK with UK based advertisers/web site owners included.

It is unfortunate that some Trading Standards departments spend so much time pursuing this matter, but argue they cannot deal with other matters of greater public concern because of lack of resources.

photographer wrote:

> as far as i know its illegal to sell 18R by mail order - this
> is to do with post office laws regarding delivering obscene
> goods.

Not sure that this would be the case with R18 as, presumably, these are
not deemed obscene...

I think the reason is more simply that the R18 certificate means that the
films can only be sold in licensed sex shops.

ReadySteady

It seems that some Licensing and Trading Standards teams take a much more sensible approach to this issue, however. There have been cases where the terms of a sex shop license allow for mail-order supply. Trading Standards would only get involved if the terms of the license were broken (e.g. supplying to someone under 18, supplying material that didn't have a BBFC certificate, etc.).

Although I believe the law is in dire need of reform (and perhaps the outcome of this fiasco will be exactly that), couldn't things could be resolved with an application of a bit of common sense ?

Peter you are right. The worrying thing is if the law is clarified it may be more restrictive than before. The requirement only to supply R18's in licenced sex shops is a problem for some people. Some Local Authorities will not issue licences and therefore there is no shop you can obtain them. The other problem is that, even in some large cities, only one shop is licenced. I have that situation and, you've guessed it, the local shop is owned by that chain that is always in dispute with some of the best providers of R18's!

We had all this bollocks back in the mid 90's when Trading Standards got uppity about adult publications taking ads from moody mail order suppliers based in Amsterdam. They went and leaned on all the mag publishers suggesting there would be dire consequences if they continued to take our ads. The upshot was that the publishers then rang us up and said "Got a bit of a problem chaps. Those small-time public sector wankers at Trading Standards have, for once, put down their copies of the Guardian and decided that they should be doing some work. Unfortunately, in this instance they've picked on the adult entertainment industry, as they don't like us anyway - apparently, it's part of their philosophy and culture that we are exploiting 'wimmin.' So, they've decided to try and enforce any current, relevant, anti-sex legislation which means that, for the time being, we can't accept any adverts from companies that supply customers with exactly what they are ordering - in this instance genuine shagging videos. So, chill out for a few weeks till the wanky little jobsworths have moved onto hassle someone else with their bullshit bureaucracy and then we'll carry on as normal." Which is pretty much what happened. Though, one famed money grabber, in the good Parish of Essex, took the opportunity to suck in his breath and say. "Oooh, I don't know. It's getting a bit risky for me lads. Taking your ads could cost me dear. It's breaks my heart, but I'm going to have to up my rates 300%. Well, it's the risk, innit?" Yeah, right Dave.

Officer D

Hi Peter

If you can get a ETO trade mag (this months issue) it explains in great detail on the front page & page 40 about court actions taken against several companies & new laws to stop R18's being sent through the post,
i would have typed it out but theres too much.

Kim