Britain's role in the world

[David Johnson]

Apparently our great leader, Cameron said on tele last night,

"The world cannot "stand aside" and allow violent repression to continue in Libya, David Cameron has told the BBC."

Where's the British government been for the past 40 years? Gaddafi's violent repression of his people doesn't seem to have been a concern previously though when he started shipping arms to the IRA the British government got the hump.

Can't remember the British government saying much when the Tamils in Sri Lanka were being hammered into submission. Have I missed Cameron's demands that we get involved in the Ivory Coast where the election results have been ignored and the country is on the brink of civil war?

Should we get involved in a military campaign in every country in the world where the people are oppressed?

Meanwhile, I thought this country of ours was on the verge of bankruptcy. Wasn't that what Cameron, Cleggie and Osborne told us? Then a few months later we are bailing out Ireland to the tune of 6 billion or so (the same as the amount of cuts that had to take place this year to avoid complete collapse). And now we look as if we are supporting a potentially, enormously expensive foreign campaign.

Is Britain a great, global power or an increasingly insignificant economy adrift in the Irish sea? I think the latter. Do we have to keep trying to play the global power game? Sweden, Norway, Finland, Germany, the Netherlands etc etc seem to be doing very well without it, whilst still doing their bit for foreign aid etc.

Cheers
D

[number 6]

You should come to the march in London on the 26th March David, if this lot are in power for another 4 years then we are all fucked. Well not all,the rich will be fine,just the rest of us.

[BGAFD Admin]

As someone says in the comments: Article of the year... Get over it Dave, we're not a world power any more

[Bob Singleton]

Call me cynical but doesn't Libya have lots of that dark, viscous liquid called OIL???? Maybe that's why the government are suddenly now so keen on getting rid of a repressive regime there, whereas we've done fuck all about Zimbabwe, Burma and elsewhere for just as long

[David Johnson]

"Call me cynical but doesn't Libya have lots of that dark, viscous liquid called OIL???? Maybe that's why the government are suddenly now so keen on getting rid of a repressive regime there, whereas we've done fuck all about Zimbabwe, Burma and elsewhere for just as long"

Libya only produces about 2% of world oil production. I dont know about now but 4 or 5 years ago, Britain produced as much oil as Libya.

So I am not so sure that the argument that the government are trying to take advantage of the uprising to secure oil supplies in Libya actually holds. The rise in the oil price recently is much more about speculation than oil shortages.

Cheers
D

[Arginald Valleywater]

Many years ago a US senator made a very harsh but fair comment....if the UK didn't have nukes nobody would take the slightest bit of notice.

[beutelwolf]

Arginald Valleywater wrote:

> Many years ago a US senator made a very harsh but fair
> comment....if the UK didn't have nukes nobody would take the
> slightest bit of notice.

Not an accurate comment though, simply because: how likely is it that the UK would deploy nukes? It really is a last resort to be used in self-defense, and it's pretty inconceivable that it'd be used to, say, get rid of one of those plentiful nasty dictators of this planet. Everybody knows that, and thus it should not make the slightest bit of difference in most contexts.

Even doubleya didn't use nukes to blast away the Taliban, and he (along with his grinning chum from Edinburgh) was pretty much on the trigger-happy side.

[frankthring]

Its an interesting topic David. You may be right in your opinion. Where
I would beg to differ is that Britain is a former (until the 1940s) World
Power of the first rank and accepting that it is anything else but a major
player on the world stage is difficult to accept......
Of course it is not so now. But I also do not believe it can be compared
quite as easily as you suggest to countries like the Netherlands, Finland
(for heaven`s sakes) or the rest of the Scandinavian bloc. Germany is
an economic powerhouse but it has never had the huge imperial
position in world affairs, even under the Kaisers.
In some areas of finance it could be argued that Britain is the most
important country - insurance for instance and some aspects of banking.
It is thus an oddball; clearly no longer in the 1st League of Nations but
among the front players in the 2nd.
The problem is this - a) British politicians talk as if we still had an imperial
navy and army when we do not; these same Whitehall scum have
destroyed both as major machines and our defence is in a shambles,
never mind talkiing rot by Cameron about sending troops to places like
Libya b) the same rot is talked about "a special relationship" with
USA when the Americans helped engineer the downfall of our Empire
and have, for most of the history, had 3 wars against this country and
relations (under Woodrow Wilson to name just one President) were
decidedly chilly.

[andy at handiwork]

I can only think of two wars between Britain and the US; the War of Independence and the War of 1812.

[David Johnson]

"Where I would beg to differ is that Britain is a former (until the 1940s) World Power of the first rank and accepting that it is anything else but a major player on the world stage is difficult to accept.....".

That's my point. The influence that countries have waxes and wanes over the centuries. Britain is not a first rank military power and it's long over due that the government accepted that.

"But I also do not believe it can be compared
quite as easily as you suggest to countries like the Netherlands, Finland
(for heaven`s sakes) or the rest of the Scandinavian bloc."

If you read my post again, you will see that I am not making a comparison. What I am stating is that these countries have at the very least an equal and I suspect much better standard of living than Britain and that they get by without any of the pathetic sabre rattling, without a sabre, that we are seeing from Cameron at the moment.

"In some areas of finance it could be argued that Britain is the most
important country - insurance for instance and some aspects of banking."

Yeah and look where it has got us. Loads of debt as a result of an over-reliance on banking tax takes and having to bail out the financial sector.

Martin Sorrell got it about right. We are a League One side. Premiership are the great powerhouses such as China. Championship are the up and comers like Brazil. Britain appears to be doing a Luton town. Unless there are big changes we could end up in the Conference.

Cheers
D