claiming Benefits, by those who dont care...

[Deuce Bigolo]

The basic single rate in australia is AUS228-00 a week plus fixed rental assistance of AUS70-AUS90-00

Rental accomodation can be anywhere from AUS200-00 minimum

I dont see a lot of leeway for a grand lifestyle unless your living in a pretty big group


Its subsistence living at best and the alcohol and drug abuse just proves people in that zone arent really happy even though they may say they are

We've got our fair share of people who see benefits as some sort of free ride but really their just short changing themselves.That dead end job that takes 30/40 hours out of your week also brings in 2/3/4 times as much as your benefit.......the sad fact is welfare agencies have allowed generation after generation through quite a few families to become welfare dependant

When you've watched your father & grand father do nothing should we be suprised if the 3rd generation follow suit?




I'm sure when i had a mild bout of depression 5 years ago i could quite easily have got a doctor to get me on sickness benefits for the duration


maybe next year when i need a holiday...lol

[David Johnson]

I was speaking to someone recently who has been a tax avoider all his life. and presumably gets a lot of money given to him as a result. Even though he is in charge of a large, corporate organisation in the UK, the corporation has never paid tax in the UK apart from nominal amounts.

I said to him a few weeks ago: "do you think you will ever pay tax again in the UK?". He replied: "I dont think so, I enjoy the substantial benefits of tax avoidance too much. I was quite shocked. Paying legitimate amounts of tax was never on his mind.

This guy couldn't care less. He will just carry on making loads of extra money at the phenomenal expense to the taxpayer. He enjoys the huge trappings of wealth this provides. How is it some people have a conscience, when others dont give a shit? Why is it that it never crosses the minds of these people that others have to get up each day, and work hard to earn their money for them? Why dont they consider these things?

What are people's theories as to why large corporations get like this? Is it superior education that makes some people uncaring, or do you think some people are just born like that? And what can be done to stop those who fleece the UK State, forever, and dont care about it, from doing so?

When are people going to realise that tax avoidance impacts the taxpayer far more than the benefit scroungers whe hear about ad nauseam?

Cheers
D

[Deano!]

Occasionally, I have worked with people who are so reluctant to do anything, and make such a deliberate mess of it, that I think it's probably better for everyone if the Government pays them to fuck off and keep out of our way.

[max_tranmere]

Deuce, you say that in Australia there is a fixed amount given in rent if one is Welfare dependant. In the UK that is not the case. It is largely unlimited, and for them to pay the rent for someone in central London will cost a lot. When you say that someone would be a lot better off working, again that may not be the case here. A person will get Incapacity, something called Disability Living Allowance, which is apparently available to everyone on Incapacity - you dont have to be physically disabled - and there is a 3rd one you can get too. Add to all that your expensive rent in central London, your Council Tax, and your National Insurance (all these things will be paid by the Government) and the person is getting a hell of a lot more each week than they would if they worked in some dead-end job. I dont know how to rectify this, unless they either vastly increase wages for unskilled work (I dont know how they could) or they have much more limited monies available to people on Benefits.

[max_tranmere]

David, very clever. Tax avoidance though costs a lot less than what Benefits cost. Before Margaret Thatcher put most of the workforce on the Dole in the 1980s, the Welfare State cost 1 pound in every 20, by the end of the 1980s it was costing 1 pound in every 3, and still does today. The Welfare State costs well over 100 billion pounds a year now, and all these fat-cat tax avoiders will amount to less than that. I am not condoning their behaviour, it is wrong and I genuinely believe I would not do that in their shoes, but then it may be so tempting to do it (seeing as you are allowed to do it) that I may. We all may, who can say? When you changed all my lines to suit this tax avoidance thing, one thing that doesn't cross-over accurately is how other people have to get up each day to earn their money for them. I don't see that one. These ultra-rich tax avoiders can only spend 2 or 3 months here in the UK anyway, and the indirect taxes they will pay will likely cover the modest amount they will cost the nation - when you consider they will likely only use private hospitals, not have their kids educated by the State system, and so on

[max_tranmere]

It's a tough one, because some people will always end up back on Benefit. When you consider that some people are so not used to the routine of working, and some people are almost totally unemployable, then they will spend most of their time on Benefit as they are totally useless. Either that or starve.

[number 6]

You just said it yourself,some people are useless,like it or not. Qe have a duty as a civilised society to feed and house these people. The choice is they starve and die,which is the way Hitler would have played it.

[David Johnson]

Hi Max,
"Tax avoidance though costs a lot less than what Benefits cost. Before Margaret Thatcher put most of the workforce on the Dole in the 1980s, the Welfare State cost 1 pound in every 20, by the end of the 1980s it was costing 1 pound in every 3, and still does today. The Welfare State costs well over 100 billion pounds a year now, and all these fat-cat tax avoiders will amount to less than that. "

The important point to get is that I am comparing tax avoidance (tax evasion before the government closes the loophole) with benefit FRAUD. I assume that you do not believe that no-one should get any benefits whatsoever in this country?

Tax avoidance is far, far more expensive than benefit fraud.

Level of tax avoidance
http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008 ... avoidance/

Level of benefit fraud
http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2009 ... fit-fraud/

"When you changed all my lines to suit this tax avoidance thing, one thing that doesn't cross-over accurately is how other people have to get up each day to earn their money for them. I don't see that one"

Just as working people pay taxes to cover the benefits of unemployed people, they also pay taxes higher than they should to cover the enormous shortfalls created by tax avoiders. They also have to pay extra for the unemployed because the tax avoiders are not paying anything towards this area.

"These ultra-rich tax avoiders can only spend 2 or 3 months here in the UK anyway, and the indirect taxes they will pay will likely cover the modest amount they will cost the nation - when you consider they will likely only use private hospitals, not have their kids educated by the State system, and so on"

You totally miss the point. Not only are we talking about personal tax avoiders here, but mainly we are talking about huge, multinational corporations such as News International and Google who have large presences here but pay minimal tax because they use complex tax avoidance techniques to avoid paying billions.

D

[Dick Moby]

I totally agree that some people need to be taken care of for whatever reason. I still don't understand why about 20 years ago there were loads of people with those big neck braces/collars but you seldom see them now. You do happen to see many people with walking sticks so I just wondered if there was a miracle cure for bad necks which has somehow caused leg/back problems.

[Sam Slater]

Greasy-haired chavs from a council estate look bad.....and so must be blamed (along with immigrants) for everything bad about society. How you can blame the fresh-faced businessmen in nice suits is beyond me, David; that's just cruel!